AFNI Message Board

Dear AFNI users-

We are very pleased to announce that the new AFNI Message Board framework is up! Please join us at:

https://discuss.afni.nimh.nih.gov

Existing user accounts have been migrated, so returning users can login by requesting a password reset. New users can create accounts, as well, through a standard account creation process. Please note that these setup emails might initially go to spam folders (esp. for NIH users!), so please check those locations in the beginning.

The current Message Board discussion threads have been migrated to the new framework. The current Message Board will remain visible, but read-only, for a little while.

Sincerely, AFNI HQ

History of AFNI updates  

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July 20, 2012 04:45PM
Michael Wrote:
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> I'm thinking we want the 1st case, where we want the average effect of
> both stimuli, not just either one.

You may think again about your choice here. "Either one" is not really an accurate description about the second test. More specifically the second one compares the following two models:

Full model: y = Effect_Of_Stimulus1 + Effect_Of_Stimulus2 + other_effects + residuals

Reduced model: y = other_effects + residuals (or beta1 = beta2 = 0)

So if the F-statistic for the second null hypothesis is significant, it indicates that either Effect_Of_Stimulus1 or Effect_Of_Stimulus2, or both are significant. As you can see, this test does tell you about the "composite" effects of the two stimuli.

My reservation about the first test in my previous response is that it weighs the effects of the two stimuli equally and one effect has the opposite sign to the other, which is rarely the case in the reality of FMRI, except for some special scenarios. More specifically the first test compares the following two models:

Full model: y = Effect_Of_Stimulus1 + Effect_Of_Stimulus2 + other_effects + residuals

Reduced model: y = Effect_Of_Stimulus1 + Effect_Of_Stimulus2 + other_effects + residuals, with the constraint of beta1 + beta2 = 0

> Could there be a case where the 1st null hypothesis fails and the
> 2nd null hypothesis above does not?

Certainly. These are two different tests, and they have both overlapping and exclusive scenarios. One obvious fact is that the first test puts a constraint on the two effects (they are presumed to have equal weight with opposite sign) but the second one doesn't.

Gang



Edited 9 time(s). Last edit at 07/21/2012 08:31AM by Gang.
Subject Author Posted

gltsym

Michael July 19, 2012 11:49AM

Re: gltsym

gang July 19, 2012 05:14PM

Re: gltsym

Michael July 20, 2012 02:52PM

Re: gltsym

gang July 20, 2012 04:45PM

Re: gltsym

Michael July 23, 2012 08:54AM

Re: gltsym

gang July 23, 2012 09:39AM

Re: gltsym

Michael July 23, 2012 11:08AM

Re: gltsym

gang July 23, 2012 05:10PM

Re: gltsym

Michael July 25, 2012 09:50AM

Re: gltsym

Michael August 16, 2013 11:20AM

Re: gltsym

gang August 16, 2013 05:18PM

Re: gltsym

Michael August 16, 2013 09:21PM